Knute, you missed this opportunity to gain some traction on how to move ahead. You need not have given 7 ideas on how to proceed. Just one would do. The rest will follow.
Leadership in the District has to be by doers not talkers. Evaluating isn't acting. Too many words and too few product-based decisions, will not do the trick.

We need to talk. I'm sad that you missed the point of this attemt to be helpful.

Call.

Art

Thanks Knute. That's a big do-list, all relevant but all somewhat overwhelming given the option subsets you describe. As Art says above, it's leadership now, and given your experience and understanding of the issues, would you please write a followup piece advocating a path forward. Right now, you're part of the chorus, with lots of good ideas but no plan.

While you're enumerating issues, please add noise. Residents, the real anchors down there, usually leave because of the street noise. Hard to control, but enforcement key.

Excellent piece. Thank you. I disagree that totem poles and Indian souvenir shops don't count. They're a street-variety tribute, albeit ersatz, to our genuine Native history, which is also on display at shops selling actual Northwest Native artwork, Edward Curtis photographs, etc. If you're looking for real when visiting New York, you tour the Chrysler Building and the Empire State Building, but it shouldn't bother you that someone else buys an "I Love NY" t-shirt. Love is love.

"Rypkema and others say the "edge" is part of the Square's urban appeal."

What an odd perspective. There is nothing attractive about people who are for whatever reason down on their luck, have no place to live and no nothing but hang around on the street, drink and beg. It's a rebuke to our self-image as 'civilized.' It's pathetic and there is no way to gussy it up by characterizing it as 'edgy,' unless one is Marie Antoinette. The general public obviously agrees or else Rypkema would never have been called in.

Nevertheless, if others think that Rypkema is correct and want to make sure that there are always homeless in Pioneer Square, here is my modest proposal: HIRE them.

Pay the homeless to stand around and act picturesque and 'edgy.' You'd want to set proper behavioral boundaries and make sure that there weren't too many on any one corner -- licensing? -- and set a reasonable dress code. Give each person a cell phone and make part of their job to act as eyes and ears for the police. Also give them a broom and a trash pail and make part of their job to keep their assigned location (a half block or so?) to keep it spotless.

You'd be taking what some see as a problem -- the homeless -- and converting it into a benefit and a certain way to attract new tourists and residents.

Now I am obviously joking — but not completely.

Gee whiz Doc and Art, you're being awfully hard on poor Skip; don't shoot the messenger.

A plan would be incomplete without considering all of these factors/bits of advice, including the eighth one that Doc adds.

Cleanscapes has been hiring the homeless to clean in Pioneer Square for years.

Groceries? Uwajimaya and AmazonFresh, or Pike Place Market if one's fortunate enough to be able to shop when things are open there and not crammed full of cruise ship foot traffic. Services in the area are more focused on the hours of the business/lunch crowd - I'd love it if the Old Seattle branch of BofA were open for a few hours on Saturdays for instance. And perhaps if more people needing those services lived here it would happen. I didn't live here during the time of theaters in Pioneer Square, but that is also sadly lacking in the area - evening entertainment that isn't a bar or club. And while the Ducks haul people through, pointing and quacking, how much better if there were an easy, free shuttle from the cruise dock down to 1st and Yesler. Or, straightforward info for small town midwestern visitors on grabbing a 15 or 18 bus south at Pike Place.

Knute -- Thanks for this. There have been many revitalization efforts over the years in Pioneer Square. I was part of an early effort to combine the 3 organizations (the BIA, the community development association, and the community council) into the PS Community Association. It made sense at the time because there was mitigation money available from the stadium developments. The neighborhood needed better coordination to access this funding and use it wisely. However, it may be time for the business community to form a separate BIA and residents to form a community council to achieve stronger advocacy on both fronts. I worked on public safety and the community association rightfully made my life miserable -- not a bad thing!

I also agree with you that it's counter productive to talk about how bad things are when you're trying to get people to come to the neighborhood. I saw the same dynamic on Broadway when I worked on revitalization efforts there.

If you ask outsiders why they don't go to Pioneer Square it's usually because they have heard that it's dangerous and they can't park. That perception must change.

Pioneer Square needs to recapture the reputation of being an arts neighborhood and not just a place to walk through on the way to a game or a place to party. Those things are important too, but the neighborhood is out of balance and has been for some time.

Knute - FYI there is a PDA that covers both Pioneer Square and the Chinatown ID neighborhood - PSIDCPDA, Pioneer Square International District Preservation and Development Association, thanks to the efforts of Rep. Santos.

From their annual Town Hall meeting invitation last month:

"The PSIDCPDA is a nonprofit, community driven organization and the first of its kind established by the state to work with two specific, historically and culturally distinct Seattle neighborhoods. Its mission is to preserve and protect the unique character of the two districts, restore and enhance the health, safety and economic well-being of residents, businesses, property owners and employees adversely impacted by the construction of, or ongoing operation of, major public facilities, public works and capital projects with significant public funding."

Historic Seattle has been charged with convening the PDA - the town hall meeting was well attended by the usual suspects from both communities and the conversation soon went from developing a broad vision to impassioned complaints about street crime. Rep Santos had to speak up several times to try to refocus the assembly.

So the PDA structure for the PS area exists - with state funding and mandate - getting agreement on a shared vision seems to be the real challenge.

Good piece, Knute. Pioneer Square worked once. We all know what's different; it's the stadiums. I can't think of a single stadium in this country that is located in a healthy urban neighborhood (the SF Giants have a gorgeous place and the surroundings are OK so far, maybe you know other examples). I do notice your inclusion of Belltown in the "troubled neighborhood" category. If that is accurate (and I think it is) I have to wonder whether more housing is going to ameliorate Pioneer Square's malaise. You can enjoy life in your Belltown condo but do remember to avoid going out on the street at night. Housing above street level can only do so much.

I agree with the "calm down" point. Neighborhoods have ups and downs and Pioneer Square's planet will keep rotating. In fact, if it becomes a cheaper area that's probably good in some ways...like becoming affordable to artists again.

That said, it does need an infusion of people. That would tone down the overreliance on narrow niche groups of various kinds.

PS, last time I looked, there was still a sizeable grocery store on Occidental just south of Yesler. And Uwajimaya of course.

Knute,
I think you missed the question "What killed Pioneer Square." It was a vibrant place when the streetcar was running. The streetcar defined the tourism district in Seattle. Tourists don't ride buses or shuttles.
The sculpture garden killed the streetcar and the loss of the streetcar killed Pioneer Square. I don't follow all this stuff on a day-to-day basis. But I seem to recall an offer from the Port for an alternate maintenance barn for the streetcar. This offer seems to have stayed on the table just long enough to get the sculpture garden approved.
I have nothing against the sculpture garden, though I haven't visited it yet. I used to go to Pioneer Square several times a year. Now I have no plans to go back. It's dead.
Get the streetcar running again and Pioneer Square will spring back to life. None of the other stuff is necessary.
--John

If you want to save Pioneer Square as a neighborhood then you need to stop thinking of it as an arts district or an entertainment and tourism mecca. It needs to be a neighborhood. The more effort you put into attracting people to the neighborhood who don't like and work there the less you will foster a sense of community.

If you want to draw people to live there and to improve the area, than you need to focus on what makes a great neighborhood and less on how many tourists you can pull in.

I'd say Pioneer District's #1 flaw is its transportation system (traffic, mass transit, sidewalks). The sidewalks are in a dismal state of disrepair and disfunction. They're broken, patched, misshapen, filthy, neglected and under-appreciated for their potential to be anything but ugly. They're not 'edgy'. This edginess, if you want to call it that, discourages rambling walks down sidestreets, ruining connectivity. Curb extensions may be a modern day invention, but they won't ruin the historic "ambience" installed throughout Pioneer Square wherever needed to improve public access, subconsciously signal motorists to slow down, and create safe crosswalks. Plant trees on them. Boo hoo, a few less curbside parking spots. Cry me a river, crocodile.

Transit has to be reliably 'frequent', both n/s up the damn hill to Pike Place and e/w to the Waterfront. To reduce traffic, transit must be convenient. That said, I'm skeptical of "Center Platform" streetcar stations on 1st Ave. Don't tell me, Frau Crunican, how pleasant it'll be waiting for the streetcar in the middle of the goddamn traffic.

Removing the AWV will create tremendous opportunity to make Pioneer District more walkable, active and popular. Make it easier and cheaper for people to park their cars and walk. It's likely the money they would've spent on driving and parking they'll spend on other things - food, souvenirs, entertainment. Oh wait, a tiny minority of church-going, wealthy, transportation-related business interests with stinking duck as a mascot own Seattle. Nevermind.

The city's Livable South Downtown Planning Study (http://www.seattle.gov/dpd/Planning/South_Downtown/Overview/) is designed to address many of the points covered in that very good article. It's written -- it was just delivered from the Mayor's Office to the City Council (Sally Clark's committee) -- it's the result of years of community participation, it could be bolder, but it's ready to go. Read about it, and then be sure to support it.

Knute, you hit it on the head—we need an organizing body that can build a coalition. However, where are the property owners in this discussion? Obviously we need input from everyone, but a coalition of retailers will have less control than over their conditions than the landlords. A Business Improvement District that included the landlords would hold all of the cards and would be able to work together to attract the type of retail mix you discuss. To see how this can really work, look at Grand Central Station in New York. They coordinated rents and hired a retail consultant to go after some of the best independent retail in New York. Hoping for a supermarket is fine, but imagine if Pioneer Square had a butcher, a Beecher's Cheese and an independent produce market. A BID could coordinate this in a way the City or disparate retailers cannot. A BID would be able to conduct ongoing research and advocate for the area with a clear voice. Most importantly, they would also be able to program the spaces that currently sit empty--which could be a great first step forward. A great example of a BID programming a dead public space and turning it around is NYC’s Bryant Park. They have outdoor movies/performances, food carts and even an outdoor reading room with donated books you can borrow and read on your lunch break.

Knute, I hope the consultant you mentioned is not the same one who recommended (and I think succeeded in) cutting down 30 or so trees in Occidental Park about five years ago. The motive for this was, of course, removing crime-fomenting vegetation (always the first of usual suspects). I suppose the city can argue that crime would be much worse if the trees had been retained.

Forget the water closet 'housing' in the north of Qwest Field parking lot. That should be a 20,000 seat all purpose arena and ringed with more upgraded bar, club, food, and meeting venues. The next earthquake may level many of the old run down, unsafe, structures under the 'Act of God' doctrine and new structures should follow subject to market forces.

Seattle is like the bedridden wealthy aunt of the Salish Sea who hoards all the tax money.

The younger inheritors of Kent, Lynnwood and Issaquah, want their inheritance so they can do what what is right for family and friends.

As much as they love her, they wish Auntie Seattle would just...fade away...

I hate what I have to say: but I don't believe anything but gentrification of the area will save it. Knock down the gross viaduct - how did it get built in the first place? Blocking off the view of the bay? Well, since the end of the Victorian age, Seattle appears to have gone blind, by and large, considering the stuff that has been built. I say what I say as a once urban pioneer
in downtown Manhattan, who with his then wife bought a 4 thous square foot loft for 10 k in 1975 which is worth about 4 million on Duane Park where the architecture is even more exquisite than it is in the Pioneer Square Area. Then I made the mistake of asking a friend, who did our electricity, the dropout UPI writer Jim Stratton, to write a book called PIONEERING IN THE URBAN WILDERNESS... and when we looked back to an area that is now the priciest in Manhattan, we had been the pioneers for the real estate moguls. But the area is restored, and becalmed. All this subsequent to what the photographer Danny Lyons recorded in THE DESTRUCTION OF LOWER MANHATTAN, the last great venture of the Rockefeller/ Moses axis.

Good to see some acutal thinking going on instead of the usual "Woe is us" that often accompanies discussions about how to "save" the Square.

I worked in the Square for ten years and was active in the Pioneer Square Community Association for five. Here's a few of my observations (in no particular order):

a) We tried the free tourist shuttle from cruise ships to PS and to Pike Market. It bombed. Few cruises have a port-of-call in Seattle (i.e., ship comes in, passengers have X hours to go ashore before the ship leaves again.) For those that do, passengers already have their iteinerary planned before they get off the boat and they won't board a bus they have never heard of before. And the cruise lines won't promote a free bus because it doesn't earn them a commission. (We couldn't even get brochures on board.) Most Seattle cruise passengers are here the day before, or the day after, their cruise so are not interested in a shuttle that takes them to or from the ship. But...

b) Cruise tourists DID use the Waterfront Trolley. Not to get to/from the ships, but as a fun, unique, and historic adventure. The loss of the Trolley easily cut the number of summer tourists by at least 25%. Ground level retail suffered tremendously when they lost this part of their customer base. The 'shrink wrap' Metro bus replacement did not bring back the tourists (though it is popular with workers) and I don't think a 'new fangled' trolley down 1st Ave. will do so either. The level of anger and resentment the retail community feels over the killing of the Trolley is substantial and should somehow be acknowledged. Otherwise it will be that much more difficult to get folks to trust/work with the city or Metro in the future.

c) More market-rate housing is absolutely necessary for two reasons. First, there needs to be someone who cares about what goes on after dark. Few PS buisnesses are open then; the ones that are (bars and clubs) don't dare speak out for fear it will be used to put them out of business. (This could change with the new Mayor). Second, more residents equals more voters. The City Council doesn't really have to pay attention to the Square because it doesn't cost, or give, them any votes. (Witness the expansion of homeless services and housing at the Morrison Hotel about five years back. The Neighborhood Plan, a Moratorium on Additional Social Services, numerous zoning regs, and packed City Council meetings were all ignored/overridden/discounted.)

d) The re-opening up of the Central Waterfront when the viaduct comes down will be huge. We need to make sure that the energy, excitement, and funding that follows does not stop at the Ferry Terminal, but continues south all the way to Royal Brougham.

e) Yes, repair the sidewalks. This is more costly and difficult than in other parts of the city because the sidewalks are also 'roofs' which span mostly hollow spaces (the Undergound). PS sidewalks are like New York's "broken windows". Fix them and you go a long way towards fixing many of the neighborhood's negative perceptions.

f) a leader would help. Jim Ellis, Charlie (from the ID who ran for Mayor), etc. Someone seen as trustworth who has charisma and a passion for the neighborhood.

Well, that's all for now. Sorry if this came out more as a negative than a positive. Also sorry I couldn't find a spell check program that would work inside this box!

As a 4th generation local, and lifetime resident, I have watched PS go from rags to riches to semi rags again. I can offer some insight has to how to gain back tourism, as I have worked as a tour guide here for almost 30 years.

While the loss of the trolley was big, it is the continued lack of space for a charter bus to park in PS (and throughout this entire city).. Everyone drives THROUGH PS because there are too few places to park a charter bus.

Yes, the vast majority of those who cruise via Seattle from May to October are in transit... but often that transit, usually inbound, often
includes a 2-3 hour city tour. Two hours or more needs a restroom break. Currently, the only PS places to pause are the new Klondike Museum and Waterfall Park. The Park is lacking in restroom capacity and sadly, the great new NPS Museum has NO place right near by for charter bus parking.

A good charter bus space needs to empty onto a sidewalk, not into the street, and thanks to high curbs and one way streets, there is nothing along the sidewalks in front of the wonderfully restored Cadillac Hotel.

The closest is near the OLD location, a block and a half away. Think mobility and line of sight, and that is not an easy option.

HERE are Three quick ideas that would help to draw tourists back to the Square:

1) Restore, rebuild, enlarge, and improve the restrooms under the park. When opened Harpers Magazine did a story on the finest public restrooms in the USA. Hire unemployed to staff them. ADA issues? Build a side ramp down, or street level lift. I bet it could be done for less than the 5 million we blew on automated outhouses a few years back. Might reduce alley odor, but would definitely create a rest stop for tours.

2) Purchase rights to the large parking lot adjacent to Occidental Park for Bus Use ONLY from 8 AM to 4 PM on all ship days. Publicize it. Promote it... Maybe even charge a modest fee for exclusive use. Expand the charter zone on Western to hold more than 3 coaches. Seriously... 4 million visit the market and this city has room for 3 coaches and they have but 5 minutes to empty 50 senior citizens. Each coach needs 10-15 minutes, and you need space on ship days for at least SIX coaches between 10 AM and 2 PM... I would hood Western from Virgina down to Post Alley.

Each coach delivers 50, and takes the place of three cars delivering 6. Hood the meters on ship days for charter coach only. Have "ambassadors" on site to meet each coach with a map that details how to walk from Pike Place to Pioneer Square, maps list shops and places to eat at both locals. Strongly encourage tours to Drop at the market, and then have the coach park off Occidental. 20 coaches parked means 1,000 tourists shopping, eating and walking through Pioneer Square to get to their coach before it takes them to the ship or airport. Its not rocket science.

Promote the parking lot as the destination in and of itself and give pax two hour to shop, dine and explore. COACH PARKING in Pioneer Square would go far to make it tour friendly...

3) Two words: BENSON TROLLEY. Before you build another streetcar in this town, make use of the money we already spent to build that line. Before it was pulled, it ran 200,000 folks on average a year. Now you have 211 cruise ships calling at Pier 91 and 66 and almost a MILLION transits... For the love of all things practical, Connect that line NORTH through Myrtle Edwards to Pier 91. Put the barn under the Magnolia Viaduct. Stops at Pier 70, and all the original stops. That line could run another 3 years before we have to interrupt it for Viaduct replacement. We own the right of way after 20 years of work, we already own the cars, and the track to Pioneer Square. We could have been earning revenue all this time we have been jabbering and instead Metro has had to SUBSIDIZE a bus for FREE.

Just a note in defense of the Occidental Park remodel. The old faux granite pavers were terrible, best forgotten, mistake not repeated. Enough London plane trees were preserved to improve park design. The original design of symetric order was too much like a tree farm.

I'm skeptical of locating the streetcar maintenance facility on the adjacent parking lot and believe the better location is Interbay. Something ought to be there instead of a surface parking lot to make the park a more active place.

The problem with this approach is that it's difficult to guarantee a consistent performance. Disney realized this early on. I'd propose that we use his solution: Audio-animatronic bums.

Here are some proposals that some might think to be radical:

1) To solve the "street people" problem (and I agree it is a real problem that shouldn't just be ignored), give them a place to live off the street. It has been shown to work with habitual drunks. Everyone in this country (or at least in Seattle) should have the right to have at least a room of their own. That, by itself, would solve over 2/3's of the street people problem in both Pioneer Square and Belltown.

2) Decriminalize drug addiction: Provide addicts with maintenance doses of their addicted substance (or substitute drug) via the public health clinic - that'll get rid of 3/4's of the drug dealers that infest Belltown and, to a lesser degree, Pioneer Square. Zone both Belltown, Pioneer Square, and Fremont for Cannibis cafes. Use the license and tax revenues to fund enforcement (prosecuting dealers) and help finance walk-in on-demand drug treatment for whoever wants it.

3) Decriminalize prostitution: Licence, tax, regulate, and zone, rather than prohibit and prosecute. Take the addicts away from dealers and the whores away from the pimps, much of the reason for gangs, and the resulting gun violence, goes away. A couple classy bordellos, with the exploitive pimps and madams cut out of the deal, could be very fitting and appropriate additions to a Pioneer Square revival, considering the district's history (and it is a "historical" district, after all). Use the license and tax revenues to fund enforcement (prosecuting pimps) and help finance therapy and safe houses for girls and women who want to get out of "the life."

Thanks, Knute, for addressing the question of Pioneer Square post-Elliot Bay.

I made the decision to open a storefront on Occidental two years ago, choosing Pioneer Square over Belltown and South Lake Union. Although we are not a high traffic retail operation, we chose the location because of its proximity to downtown and for the beautiful space we found in one of the older buildings in the neighborhood. As a result, our showroom doubles as an event space for our business and for a number of nonprofits that have asked to use the space. A sheetrocked, ceiling-tiled beige box in a new building just doesn't hold a candle to the exposed brick and timber spaces in turn of the century buildings.

In our two years in the neighborhood, we have had few instances that would cause us to question our decision to locate in Pioneer Square. Part of the credit goes to our landlord, Mickey Smith. He is local, makes long term decisions, and is genuinely interested in creating a vibrant mix of businesses in his properties. The other part is that the fears many have about Pioneer Square are unfounded, in our experience.

I am disappointed to see Elliot Bay go, but I don't think its departure will precipitate a decline in the neighborhood. Pioneer Square has been steadily improving, and, once we get beyond this current recession, I am confident that it will continue that trajectory.